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Menu and recipe advice please - Now Diary of Making !!!

Talk about period recipes & ingredients

Re: Menu and recipe advice please!

Postby Elise_Fleming » Sat Jun 01, 2013 6:05 am

How about a different pastry recipe? This was given at Ivan Day's pie and pastry course.

Cold Pie Paste

1,000 gm plain flour (2 lb 3 oz)
40 gm salt (1 ½ oz)
400 gm lard (or butter) (14 oz) (If butter, it needs a little more water; use 250 ml instead of 220.)
10 egg yolks
220 ml cold water (8 fluid oz) (Put water in refrigerator or freezer, but don’t let it go “icy”.)

Put yolks into water and mix slightly. Cut lard into almond-sized pieces. Make well; add beaten eggs gradually; don’t knead. Add water slowly in small batches! Ball it all together. Get it into round lump without cracks and without kneading. Wrap in plastic wrap. Put in refrigerator for about half an hour, although it works fine without chilling. While dough is chilling, grease the pie former with clarified butter.

Half quantity will make one large pie. Tastes better than hot water paste. Basic recipe is in a 1618 manuscript belonging to Ivan.

Or, this one which is from Tomas de Courcy's blog:

"I have about fourteen pre-1600 recipes for pastry cases, but my research project on that is currently on hold until I have more time. However, last year I did some research on two types of coffin. The whole thing is here: http://www.sca.noaharney.com/an-examination-of-coffins/ but the one you're probably looking for is:

Fourme of Curye (1390) .Cxj.

take blank suger & ayroun & flour & make a past with a rollere

And modern version:
2 C Flour
12 Egg Yolks
¼ C Sugar

Beat the sugar into the egg yolks until thickened and the colour begins to change
Mix in flour slowly with spoon, and then by hand until dough is heavy and accepts no more flour
Roll out thinly (1/4” or less)
Lay in form
Bake at 425 for about 15 minutes
Fill, cover if needed, and re-bake without form

Yes, that's correct, three ingredients. It makes a pie shell that will stand up to anything. It's blind baked, and I used a form for the blind baking, but that is not required at all if you want to form it by hand instead and blind bake it.

Give it a shot. It's completely replaced the modern hot water crust I was using for coffins."

His blog for this mentions flour types which might be of interest to you.

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Re: Menu and recipe advice please!

Postby Sophia » Sat Jun 01, 2013 12:09 pm

Sorry if this is turning into a moan - used the short crust pastry for tarts in All the King's Cooks for speed and I am sure there is a typo in it, if you make it with 1 egg yolk it simply crumbles when you try to roll it. About to try it with 3 egg yolks and if that doesn't work will consider whole eggs, don't have time for things to mess up any more. If a real reminder that I should really trial all my recipes before I make them for the event. Thing is I normally don't have any trouble with pastry and I am using a modern chef's flan ring and baking sheet for it anyway for speed.

The second Pye of Allowes also cracked a bit but I have got to the point that I don't care or I will have a nervous breakdown.

On the flour side I really do wonder if this might be the issue, the plain flour I have used for all the pastry is fresh from the supermarket (bought for the job) and is as dry as powder dust which may be affecting the mix. Still intend to trial white spelt flour for raised pies so the household is going to be eating quite a few of them in the next few months while I experiment. Determined to crack them before I do the food for Bosworth.
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Re: Menu and recipe advice please - Now Diary of Making !!!

Postby kitchen clerk » Sat Jun 01, 2013 9:04 pm

Well I had a go at Pye of Allows today, from the Proper New Book.

Image

I was in a bit of a hurry, as it was my turn spit turning, so I covertarted it. The method is also from the Proper New, and is a good way to ensure that the pie doesn't leak.

Image

Image

The paste was based on the pasta like Ryschew one, I liked the crispness!

Image

Everyone seemed to like it...
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Re: Menu and recipe advice please - Now Diary of Making !!!

Postby TerryL » Sat Jun 01, 2013 9:40 pm

kitchen clerk wrote:...

Everyone seemed to like it...


Tasty! The filling was interesting, Robert had added a few extra raisins and dates and their flavour really came through and...


... oops, sorry, I'm not supposed to have tasted it.
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Re: Menu and recipe advice please - Now Diary of Making !!!

Postby Sophia » Sat Jun 01, 2013 10:15 pm

Well Tartes of Chese now done as is everything else except the red wine syrup for the Pye of Alowes and the glazing of the Marchpane Armourial Subtlety.

Some lessons learned:

1) Trial every single recipe first

2) Preferably work from the original - other peoples versions may not work and lead to wastage and frustration

3) The washer up, dishwasher loaders and unloaders and supper cookers need a very substantial bribe afterwards. There will be hazelnut macaroons (after all why waste all those egg whites) and maybe a rich chocolate gateaux or similar in the near future.

4) Doing something as big as this for the first time just 2 weeks before going to Kentwell is not the most sensible idea.

5) I definitely need more medium sized and large plastic boxes with a reliable seal.

6) Two small fridges is not enough and I might not have enough big pans, flan rings, heavy duty baking sheets and other such lovely stuff (must order sky hooks first)

Photos of the event and the food will follow next week!!!!
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Re: Menu and recipe advice please - Now Diary of Making !!!

Postby Elise_Fleming » Sat Jun 01, 2013 11:23 pm

The food looks delicious. I'm looking forward to more photos and more reports!
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Re: Menu and recipe advice please - Now Diary of Making !!!

Postby TerryL » Sat Jun 01, 2013 11:32 pm

Elise_Fleming wrote:The food looks delicious. I'm looking forward to more photos and more reports!


If you were referring to Robert's post, I did a rush job for him on the Pye of Alowes images

https://picasaweb.google.com/1022039137 ... directlink


The full set of pictures from today will be linked to once I have a chance to go through them next week - I'll leave Robert to comment about the making and the any thoughts he had about the process.
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Re: Menu and recipe advice please - Now Diary of Making !!!

Postby Sophia » Sun Jun 02, 2013 12:01 am

TerryL wrote:
Elise_Fleming wrote:The food looks delicious. I'm looking forward to more photos and more reports!


If you were referring to Robert's post, I did a rush job for him on the Pye of Alowes images

https://picasaweb.google.com/1022039137 ... directlink


The full set of pictures from today will be linked to once I have a chance to go through them next week - I'll leave Robert to comment about the making and the any thoughts he had about the process.


Thank you as ever for your photos Terry, really interesting when I cannot make it down to the Palace :-D
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Re: Menu and recipe advice please - Now Diary of Making !!!

Postby kitchen clerk » Sun Jun 02, 2013 10:50 pm

An interesting book, The Proper Book, in a lot of ways. Less than 50 recipes, and a lot of them nothing like what happened before, or since, even though it was in print for thirty years.
As we are talking about pastry here, my favorite today was from the Proper Book.
It's like a hot water paste, but with butter rather than lard, so when it cools it's softer. So it can elastically envelop a chicken, and be waterproof and crisp.
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Re: Menu and recipe advice please - Now Diary of Making !!!

Postby TerryL » Sun Jun 02, 2013 11:37 pm

kitchen clerk wrote:An interesting book, The Proper Book, in a lot of ways. Less than 50 recipes, and a lot of them nothing like what happened before, or since, even though it was in print for thirty years.
As we are talking about pastry here, my favorite today was from the Proper Book.
It's like a hot water paste, but with butter rather than lard, so when it cools it's softer. So it can elastically envelop a chicken, and be waterproof and crisp.


Have you been doing that whole chicken in a pie thing again?
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